More extracts from proofs of age (see the last post directly beneath or here), in the Calendar of Inquisitions Post Mortem 1300-1307 and 1307-1327:
1300, Derbyshire: Richard Daniel (elder brother of John Daniel, killed on the orders of Roger Mortimer in November 1326) is known to have been born in Wexford on 25 April 1274 partly because "Roger de Cheilmardon, aged 70 and more, says that at about the feast of All Saints 26 years ago he came to the house of the said William [Foljaumb], and seeing the said Richard an infant asked who he was, and was answered and told that he was born in Ireland, at which he greatly marvelled."
1301, Northumberland: Margery de Bocland, daughter and heiress of Elias Cusyn, was born on 25 January fifteen years previously:
"Simon de Ruchestre, aged 42, agrees, and remembers because he was then building his hall, 15 years ago.
William Gryse of Matfen West, aged 54, agrees, and remembers because at the feast of Easter next after the said birth, Robert his brother was slain by robbers going to York on the business of Sir John de Herteweyton, 15 years ago, and he loved his brother above all living.
Adam son of Bernard de Ryhill, aged 40, agrees, and remembers because on the day she was born there was a great storm, and he was on his journey from Ryhill to Brynckeburn, and when he had to ride across the Coket he was nearly drowned, and that was 15 years ago."
1302, Ireland: Gilbert de Clare, lord of Thomond (died 1307, nephew of Gilbert 'the Red' de Clare, earl of Gloucester (died 1295), first husband of Hugh Despenser the Younger's sister Isabel, and brother of Margaret, Lady Badlesmere and Maud, Lady Clifford) was proved to have been born in Limerick on 3 February 1281 on the testimony of twelve men, including the following:
"Elias de Cheyne agrees, and recollects because his mother sent to Juliana de Clare the said Gilbert's mother a present by him on the day she was in labour, 21 years ago...
Robert de Inscul agrees, and recollects because he was in a fight at Kyldroyn between the English and Irish on Monday after All Saints, when Robert le Butiller, knight, was wounded whereof he died, and the said Gilbert was born a year after; which fight was 22 years ago...
Maurice Gerveys agrees, and recollects because Walter his brother was wounded in the aforesaid fight so that his life was despaired of.
Stephen Kyvernok agrees, and recollects because he was serving the said Thomas [de Clare] the father at his table, when news came to him of the birth of the said Gilbert."
(Thomas de Clare (d. 1287) helped the future Edward I escape from captivity in 1265, with the aid of Roger Mortimer's grandfather Roger Mortimer (d. 1282); Edward subsequently defeated Simon de Montfort at the battle of Evesham.)
1303, Nottingham: Richard son and heir of Hugh le Heryz was born on the day of Holy Trinity 1282:
"...in that year the king was in the war of Wales, and Llewellyn prince of Wales was taken and slain after the feast of St Martin...
William Torkard of Boneye, aged 50, agrees, and recollects because in Whitsun week before the said Richard's birth, Margery his wife taken with great weakness bore a son scarcely six thumbs in length, who nevertheless lived until he was baptised and then died...
John son of John of Stapelford, aged 41, agrees, and recollects because John his father was in the war of Wales with Sir Peter de la Mare and was drowned with his lord and many others, as well knights as others, in the water of Conewey [Conwy] on the day of St Leonard next after the said Richard's birth 21 years ago."
(That's a reference to the battle of Moel Y Don and the collapse of Edward I's bridge across the Menai Strait on 6 November 1282.)
1305, Gloucester: John son and heir of Robert de Stallinge was born on 8 November 1283:
"William de la Haye, aged 48, agrees, and knows it because on the day that the said Maud [John's mother] purified herself the said Robert [de Stallinge] made a feast to all his neighbours, but did not invite him, at which he was angry."
1307: Richard son and heir of Adam de Stubhuse was born on 1 November 1286:
"John Scarthcroft, aged 50, says the same, and knows it because he was in a certain house on the said day and year."
Well, that's not vague at all, is it?
1308: John son and heir of Simon le Hauekere was born on St Clement's Day 1285:
"William Quynton of Conyton, aged 54, says the same, and knows it because he married his wife Thephania in 12 Edw. I and buried her on the same eve of St Clement, 13 Edw. I, in the cemetery of Conyton, and was almost mad with grief.
Roger de Hiltone, aged 60, says the same, and recollects it because on the same day of St Clement he held a feast in honour of the saint, when, all his neighbours sitting at dinner, his oven and kitchen were burned.
John Pollard of Fendrayton, aged 40, says the same, which he recollects because on that same day of St Clement he was robbed and wounded almost to death by robbers."
1308: Margaret de Harle, daughter and co-heiress of Brian de Brompton, was born on 28 October 1293:
"Hugh de Bolledon, aged 60, says the same, and knows it because he had a son who fled from his house with a greyhound to Huggeford on the said day, and did not return for two days."
1308: John brother and heir of Robert de Derle was born on the Friday after the Purification twenty-two years previously:
"Robert de Dethek, knight, aged 60...knows it because on Saturday after the Epiphany last, twenty-two years ago, Henry de Derle, father of the said John, went with him from Nottingham to Derle, fell ill of the excessive cold, and died within a fortnight after, and Alice his wife bore the said John on the said Friday following.
William de Hopton, aged 50, says the same, and knows it because he begot a daughter Alice of one Edda de Metlak, who was born on the day of the Purification last twenty-three years ago, and was weaned the end of that year, and the said John was born twenty-two years ago, and the same Edda was hired for his nurse."
1309, Suffolk: Bartholomew son and heir of John Davelers was born on 28 September 1287:
"Robert le Vyte, aged 66, says as above, and knows it because on that Friday he came to the hall of Everwarton for 14 shillings due to him for a cloth of russet, and found the lady lying in childbed...
Richard le Warde, aged 55, says as above, and knows it because on that Friday he was repairing the house of Roger le Priur at Everwarton, and fell and broke his right leg."
1310: Elizabeth, younger daughter and co-heiress of Brian de Brompton (and sister of Margaret de Harle above), 'was 14 on Wednesday after St Nicholas last':
"Adam Osberne, aged 60, agrees, and knows it because when building a chamber in his place near the manor of the said Brian, he heard the said Elizabeth wailing...
Richard Faber, aged 60, says the same, and knows it because William de Drayton his servant was slain in Ayston the same day, and in following the felon he saw the said Elizabeth being baptised at the door of the church.
William de Weston, aged 50, Richard de Morton, aged 40, Philip de Castro, aged 50, and Adam Hasard, aged 40, agree, and know it by many evident reasons."
Which would be...?
1312, Cambridge: John son and heir of William Heved was born 'on the day of St Benet, 17 Edw. I':
"William Quynton, aged 52 and more*, says the same, and knows it because he had a wife named Thephania (Thiph'), who died on the day of Holy Trinity, 18 Edw. I**, and was buried on the Sunday following in the graveyard of Conyton; and for the sale of an ox on the same day of St Benet he was excommunicated by the rector in the said church...
William Morel, aged 80, says the same, and knows it because he had a son Henry who the same day and year set out on pilgrimage for Rome, and never returned."
* William was said to be 54 in 1308 in John le Hauekere's proof of age, above.
** He said that Thephania died in 13 Edw. I, not 18 Edw. I, in John le Hauekere's proof of age. Hmmm.
That last entry about William Morel's son makes me feel sad; how awful never to know what happened to your child.
1314, Lincolnshire: Peter kinsman and one of the heirs of Peter de Campania was born 'on the eve of St Laurence 18 Edw. I' (9 August 1290):
"Lambert ad Ripam of Netelham, aged 50, says the same, and knows it because the men of the township of Netelham built a chapel in honour of the Blessed Virgin Mary in the year of the said Peter's birth, and he with others went on the said day of St Laurence to Saxilby to buy timber for the said chapel, and the men of Saxilby announced the birth of the said Peter to him...
John Luyght of Netelham, aged 45, says the same, and knows it because on the said day of St Laurence he carried hay from Saxilby to Netelham which he bought of one William in the Croft, who announced to him the said Peter's birth, and one of his horses fell and broke its neck."
Love these, especially the poor guy who didn't get invited to the feast and the son fleeing with the greyhound!
I really like those two as well! And the man who burned his kitchen trying to cook for his neighbours. ;-)
well, I'm intrigued about the house where John Scarthcroft was - maybe 'ill repute'?:>
These are so neat to read! It kind of goes to show we should listen to those people who sound kind of crazy to us when they relate odd details, but the mind works in mysterious ways! Thanks for putting this together and sharing it with us. So much fun :)
Poor William didn't get invited to the party. Yeah, that's an insult to remember. ;)
Anerje, I bet is was a house of ill repute and John wasn't a regular or he'd rarely remember a special occasion. ;)
Hehehe, have to agree with you both about the house of ill repute, Anerje and Gabriele. ;-) And I feel pretty sorry for William - all his neighbours being invited, and him feeling left out, bless. :)
Thanks, Elizabeth - really glad you enjoyed the post! I just adore details like this, and it really brings the era so close to me. And very true about the mind working in mysterious ways!
Great stuff, and shows how the human mind works (some things don't change).
"because he was in a certain house on the said day and year"
I suspect not so much vague as trying to be discreet. I have a mental picture of him blushing beetroot while giving evidence, and probably trying to avoid his wife's eye :-)
I'd remember too, if I wasn't invited to a party. Maybe he should have crashed it!
Carla: so true. This is just how I remember things from a few years ago, too. Hehe, yes, discretion rather than deliberate vagueness does seem likely, doesn't it...? :-)
Hi Theresa, and welcome to the blog! I hope he did gatecrash the party, haha! :)
I need to ask a few questions...
* DID Walter Gerveys die after the fight?
* Can we add Edda de Metlak to the "list of
* William Quynton was excommunicated for selling
* Did Robert le Vyte realise he had walked in on a
birth of a baby?!
Great post !!
Thanks, Kate! I'd love to know the answers to those questions, too! :-) Edda is a good name, isn't it?
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